ignition problem in the GE

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:28 pm

hi guys. i am trying to put EFI on my GE sigma and the car was running fine before i started. i have put on the inlet manifolds and wired in the microtech digi. i am trying to start the car, but it wont fire. i am getting spark. i have put in the distributor correctly.. i occasionally get a bit of a huff from the back of the car like a bit of a fire happened..

here are some symptoms..

* my coil is getting very hot.. is this normal? i have tried using a different coil and the same is happening
* on the + side of the coil i'm only getting 5 volts.. is this normal
* i have tried using a different distributor..

if i put the distributor wires on incorrectly on the coil, could it have fried it?

any help would be super duper guys..

thanks,

Dane

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:29 pm

Oh, for more info, i also swapped from the standard GE head to a M4 Magna head.. if that changes anything???

the Digi is good as it was out of JET 51G and ran fine.. the distributor i tried was out of JET too and so was the second coil...

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:56 pm

Also, the 'ignition ballast' is extremely hot too.. looked up what it was in the GE manual...

rob020 · Post by **rob020** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:25 pm

you wont need the ballast resistor... what ignition module are you using? then i can look up the proper coil wiring for you

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 6:17 pm

its all standard GE sedan setup..

i just put it back to normal and left the ignition on and the coil and ballast was frying agian.. and still only 6 volts..

as i said, coild i have fried something by putting the wries from the dizzy on the coil wrong? i am terrible with ignition stuff...

Post by **ddt** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:17 pm

The ballast resistor is there to drop the voltage which you won't need. If including the ballast resistor is the only thing that's wrong then ur coil should be fine.

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:08 pm

i dont know if there is something wrong with that or not.. they are over heating.. that is one prob i cant figure out why.. and the other is that the coil is only getting 6 volts.. i mean if you sit in a car park with the ignition on listening to music for example, the coil shouldn't fry like it is.. so just wondering what could be making it over heat. and what could make the coil only get 6 volts?? something shorting out which drops the voltage and is cooking the coil and ballast maby?? but if i haven't changed anything how could that have happened? and where/what?
if i put the dizzy wires on wrong, could it have damaged something maby?

sorry if i sound rude at all, i'm just struggling to get my head around understanding this problem lol.. i really appreciate the help and ideas

any suggestions on what i should try to do to fix the prob i will happiely try.. and how can i remove the ballast if you say its not needed?

CHEERS

Post by **ddt** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:40 am

if you had a sparkplug shorting i imagine that would heat up your coil and resistor big time. Maybe disconnect one spark plug lead then try starting. Then check the others and have a go starting. You might get some clues by trying that.

My car still started on 3 cyls after i'd been sold the wrong coil (GT40 coil instead of a GT40R, i think) -it just ran terribly.

I have never bypassed a ballast resistor so can't offer much advice. From the wiring diagram it appears it's just 2x 85ohm resistors in parallel so it looks like all you'd need to do is join up all the connections going to the ballast resistor together. Does the coil you are using say on it if its designed for use with a ballast resistor?

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:32 am

the coil i'm using is the factory coil that was running with the factory ballast the last 33 years.. so it is ment to run with it..

and the over heating issue. i just have the key turned to ignition, not start. so i'm not trying to start the car... so it couldn't be a spark plug. thats why i'm saying its strange. if i'm cranking the car heaps, i'd assume things would get hot, but they shouldn't when just sitting there..

i'll try unplugging the ballast now and see what voltage i get at the coil..

also, i'll do a dodgy and run a wire from the battery directly to the coil so it definatly gets 12 volts and see if the car starts.. i just feel that the coil only having 6 volts is A problem if not the only one...

rob020 · Post by **rob020** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:45 am

your using a microtech digi though right? the standard coil and ballast were run by the standard dizzy for the last 33 years, your ecu controlls the spark directly through an ignition module..

positive side of the coil should have a direct connection to the cars +12v ign on source and the +12v pin on the ignition module, the negative side of the coil should ONLY be connected to the coil -ve pin of the ignition module, NO BALLAST, the module controls the voltage/dwell etc

if you are using a bosch module it shouldnt be too hard to look up the wiring for it on the internet and check over your wiring

cheers,
rob

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:58 am

the digi is fuel only.. that ignition is run as normal

rob020 · Post by **rob020** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:05 am

AHHHHHHHHHH!... sorry :facepalm:

rob020 · Post by **rob020** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:08 am

5 volts on the coil is very low.. i think with a ballast you should have at least 9v.. and it should get full volts while cranking im pretty sure...

do you have the ecu controlling the fuel pump? does it prime when you turn the ignition on? can you hear the injectors firing? after cranking does the exhaust pipe smell like petrol?

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:53 am

the ballast is getting 12 volts go in and 12 volts going out

so that is good.. the control unit is getting 12 volts at the 3 points it needs it as it says in the workshop manual.. the 3 earth points i dont know how to test as i dont know who to test OHms or resistance..

the ECU does control the fuel pump and it is supposed to prime, but when i turn key to ignition where its supposed to prime, it doesn't.. i need to turn the key that little bit more as though i'm about to start the engine before it will prime. dont know if that is a prob or not. just thought i should mention it ;)

the ecu flashes saying its opening the injectors, but i dont know if they are firing or not.. i'll crank it now and smell the exhaust ok ;) also, we sprayed some 'start ya bastard' in the throttle and it didn't make any firing attempt...

also, i have a spare running GE, so i might go get the controle unit, distributor and coil from it and see if i can get it started and narrow down the cause... that'd be a last resort though as my nan wont have it there if its not running and mum wont either... but at least that way i can, say put the other dizzy on and if it starts, there's my prob, then the coil, then the control unit etc... if they all swap over and it still wont start, then i know that mine should all be good and the prob is elsewhere...

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:18 pm

ok. so i'm getting a fume smell come from the exhaust.. so i'm assuming fuel.... just had ignition on after plugging back in the control unit and the ballast was scolding hot within a few minutes... to the point where my finger hissed as i touched it lol.. my finger must have had some rain water on it.. this is frustrating! i'll go get my other GE when my nan gets home i think.. i'll test things too and fro.. swap coil first and see if i'm getting 12 volts with that one i think..

at least this is forcing me to learn something about ignition lol

rob020 · Post by **rob020** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:39 pm

hmm, i dont think it should get that hot

to test the earth points you just want to check continuity to the chassis.. or even the negative terminal of the battery.. the less resistance the better

if you have access to a carby magna for parts or even a gk sigma they have a dizzy/coil setup that only requires 2 wires to be connected to your car, an earth and an ignition on

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 12:43 pm

ok so just tested the ballast again and it is getting 12 volts go in and only 7 go out which is what the coil is getting.. so we are going to by pass the ballast for now to see if it is the problem

13bsigma · Post by **13bsigma** » Sat Apr 23, 2011 3:12 pm

SILVIA HAS EFI!!

it runs.. dont know why or how.. but fiddleing with things.. used a dizzy i had used before and a coil i had used before and i was getting spark suddenly and12 volts at coil and the ballast wasn't cooking itself. still no start, changed timing over and over again, re installing dizzy to insure it was correct.. so it was suggested to me to try another dizzy.. again, one i had tried before and this time it fired into life and died.. so i checked the tune on the microtech to insure it was getting enough fuel.. the microtech has a after start inrichment, so i assumed it was getting that inrichment, firing into life, then starving... richened up the mixtures and tried it and it idled so smoothly almost instantly

strange thing is that the dizzy that was failing to work is the one out of jet which was running 18PSI quite happiely.. bizzar lol... i'm happy now

big thank you for the help guys

Sigma-galant.com

ignition problem in the GE

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