aluminium panelling

[Scorpma82]

Hi guys,

As you've probably read, i'm planning on building another GJ wagson with the GJ scorpion nose.

Since i wanna keep the original engine, it wont be terribly powerful....but unfortunately it will be a bit of a heavy weight....not good for performance. and since the car will be street registered.....it's illegal to run fiberglass panels......so my theory (and question) is.....can u make aliminium panels for weight reduction as opposed to the original steel ones???


how much lighter would an aluminium front guard be compared to the original???

[shuggy]

I guess you could but would cause major electrolysis much like if you were to use ally rivets in steel panels. If you do this you will need to attach sacrifice anodes i think

[Scorpma82]

rivets??????

no no i mean (for now) have aluminium guards and bonnet so i can still use convential bolts

i just wanna try and lighten the bloody so its not such a fat-ass lol

[Scorpma82]

ahhh i get ya now...thanks for that

And for the record...no, im not made of money....if i were.....there'd be a sigma running in Top Doorslammer or at least in Comp Eliminator as a AA/G car!!!

And for the work, it just so happens that my step-brother earns a living in car restorations and spends his days building panels from scratch and my dad works in the plant and equipment industry which gives me access to use metal benders, rollers, presses, lathes, mills etc etc etc


It's really a classic case of not what u know, but who u know


my intention was to make an aluminium nose cone...with the bonnet and front guards as one piece...but wanted to use aluminium so it made he car lighter...but also it didn't take a shipping crane to pick up the entire nosecone

[75wagon]

Body panels aren't all that heavy.
I'd spend the time and effort of engine mods to improve performance that way.

I think you'd find greater gains.

Plus, that's pretty hard work to get panels made from scratch. He must owe you some pretty big favours?

Dave...

[Scorpma82]

no there's no favours owed...thats he job...it's what he's qualified to do

i'd love to get the panel gaps as minimal as possble and get the body 'image' as smooth as possible.....if that means i can get rid of panel gaps altogether at the front...then great....i've even thought about sealing up the tailgate and having it open like the old kingswoods to remove the panel gaps that go right around the back of the car so on the side view......u'd only have the panel gaps between the doors (which i plan to reduce anyway)

[flyingbrick]

ahhh i get ya now...thanks for that

And for the record...no, im not made of money....if i were.....there'd be a sigma running in Top Doorslammer or at least in Comp Eliminator as a AA/G car!!!

I'm pretty sure if you were made of money sigma's would be the last car you'd drive.

[geezer101]

Aluminium sheet metal is a nightmare. A gauge thin enough to make a replacement body panel will have literally no elastic integrity (if something knocks it, it will not be able to spring back into shape) Ask a panel beater who's (tried) fixed a bonnet on a Skyline... Take a page out of the HQ stock racer's book and grind the panel thickness down to reduce weight (they don't really do that, it would be cheating )

[C_Fernance]

I've heard stories of acid dipping panels as well in various forms of motorsport.

[shuggy]

just drill millions of holes in your car so it looks like mesh and wrap in wall paper

[Scorpma82]

Aluminium sheet metal is a nightmare. A gauge thin enough to make a replacement body panel will have literally no elastic integrity (if something knocks it, it will not be able to spring back into shape) Ask a panel beater who's (tried) fixed a bonnet on a Skyline... Take a page out of the HQ stock racer's book and grind the panel thickness down to reduce weight (they don't really do that, it would be cheating )

So how is it that motor companies (albeit..the most expensive ones) build the entire car out of it it??? do they have much thicker panelling?????? I would've thought that wouldn't be thecase as u can put a di
nt in a coke can.....and press it out again and u can actually hear the can 'spring' back into shape???

[Superscan811]

So how is it that motor companies (albeit..the most expensive ones) build the entire car out of it it??? do they have much thicker panelling??????

They heat treat it to artifically "age harden" it, along with using specialized aluminium alloys you are not likely to find at Bunnings or your local sheetmetal shop.

Cheers.

[ddt]

just drill millions of holes in your car so it looks like mesh and wrap in wall paper

Hey Shuggy, that could be a good idea!
The density of steel is abt 7 to 8g/cc
aluminium is under 3g/cc
body filler is around 1g/cc (but would vary widely between products i imagine)
so if you drilled half your panels away and bogged them up you might get something like a 40% weight reduction in panel weight!

[Scorpma82]

I'd be tempted to not fill the holes and get personal plates "GRATER"

But honestly...wouldnt the panels lose all the strength???
And also, the car could look like a golf ball once its painted coz ur painting on a canstantly changing surface aren't u???

[A112H]

[Scorpma82]

WTF!!!!!!!

Looks like an egg carton !!!! lol

[A112H]

And also, the car could look like a golf ball once its painted coz ur painting on a canstantly changing surface aren't u???

[amgis_obrut]

imagine the engine you could build for the cost of the alloy panels and even the new alloy panels would be subject to ADR's

hint, have a read of NCOP regarding fibreglass panels, bonnets and guards can be approved but they need to have a minimum thickness of 3.5mm

http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/ ... 011_v3.pdf

[bruggz351]

I'd be tempted to not fill the holes and get personal plates "GRATER"

[geezer101]

CX 500 meets Mad Max. Ugh! At least the guy who owns this will never be able to reproduce...

[bruggz351]

Almost geezer, it's a Guzzi.

But yeah, that's one insane saddle...
Came across it on hols one year at Evans Head. A real rat rod job eh...

[geezer101]

I thought it was a honda with a nasty custom frame! Someone takes an awful bike and makes it worse...

[Scorpma82]

I'd be tempted to not fill the holes and get personal plates "GRATER"

Satan's Vasectomy!!!

[Scorpma82]

imagine the engine you could build for the cost of the alloy panels and even the new alloy panels would be subject to ADR's

hint, have a read of NCOP regarding fibreglass panels, bonnets and guards can be approved but they need to have a minimum thickness of 3.5mm

http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/ ... 011_v3.pdf

And i have heard of fibreglass pannelling being ADR approved but i'm also worried how the paint job would come out if half of the car is fibreglass and the other half metal....at least with aluminium panels...it's still an 'all-steel' car....i personally would've thought it would be easier to ADR approve.

If I were to build a little purpose built toy/track hack...then i'd go down the path of removing absolutely panel and making a fibreglass version of them.

(TO be perfectly honest i'm deciding to build a track-hack sedan or a realy nice street bruiser)

[A112H]

The paint should be fine with no discernable difference between FRP and steel. If you are using metallic you will see a difference between the metal and the aluminium.
FRP is fine for non structual panels. In the case of the bonnet it will need to be braced, same for a boot lid.
As far as weight goes I really don't think you would be saving anything at all, in fact to achieve the same integrity of the steel panel I wouldn't be surprised if the glass panel was heavier.
Why are they used? Well as best as I can tell the two main reasons for using FRP panels are the ease of making your own if damaged (drift, speedway) and ease of modification (flares, vents etc.)
As far as road use goes I would be interested in FRP guards for two reasons, make a nice job of removing the indicators and they will never rust.

IMHO; The aluminium is a silly idea, it will never look right and will cost thousands.

[Scorpma82]

well to be perfectly honest i havent done any quotes or costing s on it (or any other real research for that matter).......it was more of an idea/theory on something that MAY be able to be done......I had thought about making the bonnet and front guards one piece so i can get rid of the panel gaps to give it a smoother look.....and whilst i'm at it.....flare the hell out of the front guard to accept a wide front tyre.......was a thought/theory.....not much else to be honest......but i do appreciate the feedback +ve or -ve