Galant vs. Lancer vs. Sigma 5 speed gearboxes

[davetrees]

I've searched the forum for this info, but haven't found anything definitive ... what exactly are the differences between the various narrow Jap 5-speed boxes ?

I have this one in the shed .... it was a s/h Jap import back in the 80s sometime. It was fitted into a GA Galant rally car behind an import Lancer 1600GSR (4G32) motor, but there's no guarantee that they were a "matched pair".


It fitted in the Galant without modification to the transmission tunnel ....

.....so obviously a different casing (or at least extension housing) to a Sigma box. It measures around 615mm from the bellhousing face to the shifter.

I have read in various places on the 'net that the Galant/Lancer 5-speeds were a KM119 box, while the 2L Sigma box was a KM132 ?
(not to be confused with the Starion etc KM132 of course ... MMC love to make it hard, don't they !

According to the 4G3x Service Manual though (which includes the 5-speed) the Lancer box is a KM132, not a KM119 :


There is also no sign of a serial number in that location on my box.

So does anyone have any definitive info (ie. from factory documentation, as opposed to just stuff on websites) regarding exactly which box came in what, and how to identify them ? I'm particularly interested in what ratios this box is likely to have - without pulling it to bits & counting the teeth on every gear !

Also, what box did the LC Lancers here come with standard ? I'm guessing it would be the "Lancer" rather than "Sigma" box ?

Dave

[Rally_2.6LC]

Interesting questions mate, wish I could help.
I put a narrow block 5 speed in my GC and apart from moving the gearbox mount back (as everyone here says is the standard modification) I also needed to chop a bit of my floor to make the shifter fit through and I didnt think this was the case unless it was a Wide block gearbox.
This same narrow block gearbox that I had to chop the GC floor for fitted perfectally in my LC lancer as thats what I pulled it out of.
I know with the wide block there is a difference in extension housing on the end and some of them need chopping and some dont.

Ill be keeping an eye on this if anyone can help.


Cheers Matt

[75wagon]

Very interesting gearbox you have there Dave, I certainly have never seen a 5 speed with the shifter in that location, unfortunately I cannot help you with it's identification

This same narrow block gearbox that I had to chop the GC floor for fitted perfectally in my LC lancer as thats what I pulled it out of.

That would be because LC Lancers only ever came with the 5 speeds and not the 4 speeds (LB hatches came with either 4 or 5)

I know with the wide block there is a difference in extension housing on the end and some of them need chopping and some dont.

GE/H Sigmas, and Scorpions use the shorter shifter location (same shifter location as the LC hatch 5 speed).
GJ onwards Sigmas use the longer shifter location (which causes problems when fitting to Galants/Lancers).

[davetrees]

I put a narrow block 5 speed in my GC and apart from moving the gearbox mount back (as everyone here says is the standard modification) I also needed to chop a bit of my floor to make the shifter fit through and I didnt think this was the case unless it was a Wide block gearbox. This same narrow block gearbox that I had to chop the GC floor for fitted perfectally in my LC lancer as thats what I pulled it out of

Having to enlarge the shifter hole back about 50mm has alwys been required to fit a 2L Sigma-type box in a Galant ... nothing to do with wide or narrow block, it's about the position of the shifter.

I had assumed (although on no particular basis !) that the LC 5speed boxes were a KM119 box (that's what the Celeste workshop manual says, anyway) and would fit into a Galant or Lancer without having to cut the tunnel. Obviously that's not the case, from your experience. Do you know what the ratios in the LC box are ?

GE/H Sigmas, and Scorpions use the shorter shifter location (same shifter location as the LC hatch 5 speed). GJ onwards Sigmas use the longer shifter location (which causes problems when fitting to Galants/Lancers)

Even with the early Sigma boxes you still have to enlarge the shifter hole back to fit them in a Galant, I think ?



By counting the turns of the input vs. output shafts on mine, it seems to have the same ratios as the Jap Sigma box we got here (ie. 3.369 1st gear etc) which is different to the early Galant 5speed box from what info I have been able to find.

I know the one I have is a JDM box of some sort - most likely from a Jap-spec Lancer. My best guess at the moment is that it's either a 1600 or 1600GSR box ... what I really need is a JDM brochure or similar for the Lancer that lists the gear ratios so I can confirm this.

In any case, it will be an improvement over the 4 speed, and even though there isn't a lot of difference in the 2-3 gap between them in terms of rev drop, the taller 2nd gear will let me carry more speed at the same rpm which will work better for what I need for then type of events I mostly do. At the moment I am often in the situation where I'm flogging it too hard in 2nd, but 3rd is just that bit too fast with the stock diff for my limited driving talent !

[75wagon]

GE/H Sigmas, and Scorpions use the shorter shifter location (same shifter location as the LC hatch 5 speed). GJ onwards Sigmas use the longer shifter location (which causes problems when fitting to Galants/Lancers)


Even with the early Sigma boxes you still have to enlarge the shifter hole back to fit them in a Galant, I think ?

I appologise for no explaining myself correctly.
Other then the box you have,
4 speeds have the standard Galant/Lancer shifter location.
5 speeds (early Sigma/Lancer hatch/GAlant hardtop) have the shifter located 50mm further back.

Note: 5 speeds come in 2 bell housing widths, as well as 2 different shifter locations depending on which model it came from (not including the pic of the box you have included above Dave, which shares the 4 speed shifter location).