Hopper stoppers brake upgrade

[A112H]

I like the idea but have two issues
1. I just got my new brakes
2. If I went 5 stud front what diff would you suggest? VL or XF both are available with discs and lsd. Either one would be strong enough for a GC making no more than 200RWKW, or something completely different?

[Sean]

I can't commit to purchasing your upgrade, I started researching this 24 hours ago, but I am not afraid at all of spending cash, only afraid of buying something I don't need.

I think I'll stick the above mentioned rotors and pads on the missus scorpion, see how they feel, and watch with interest what you come up with for mine. I'm in need of a new gearbox to get it moving before I spend money on making it stop - I've got a thread going on this in the gearbox section using a late 80's Ford Courier bellhousing to mate an RX7 box up using a scorpion/sigma clutch (based on an upgrade done by starion owners in the states).

Sean

[HoonBoy]

yeah well the ford pattern is 114.3 x 5 stud 72 degree splay and the disc rotor i use is ba falcon so no worries there i will find out a price on the ap calipers (i think there pretty pricey) but no dramas ,the cheaper alteritive is nissan 4 spots of skylines but havnt had a chance to look at it yet ,at the moment im using a stock ba falcon caliper PBR twin spot and thay workwell its a light car and brake fade isnt a issue ,and yes ive pushed it hard
the holden pattern is 120 x 5 stud 72 splay useing late model vy disc rotor and caliper to easy to find there a dime a dozen at every wrecker

Realistically, I should stick with the Nissan 4-spots, but the AP look sooo good. I don't have any fade issues with the Commy/NSX combo with race pads, but I've got bugger all power at the moment so they don't get pushed too hard. They don't feel the best and I am guessing this is down to the calipers flexing, just about everything else has been changed so it has to be the calipers.

[Cottees]

I'd be interested in purchasing a set, but probably not for a while. I would only order one if I had the cash there ready. I would want to keep the stock 4x114.3 stud pattern though. I currently have drums on the back, but will be upgrading to a disk brake diff. Would stock Sigma/Scorpion rear disks be large enough to be paired with larger front disks?

[Sean]

Yeah i'm wondering the same... would a decent pair of pads and rotors in the back of a scorp be ok with these front upgrades, or would all the proportioning be out of whack....

What are you guys using on the back? Easiest just to stick a borgy diff in with falcon/commodore disk brakes? Otherwise the Skyline or hilux etc...

This isn't the place for the merits of the different diffs, but wondering what brakes you guys have hanging off your diffs

[HoonBoy]

So how much for the hubs and brackets for the Nissan 4-spot setup?. (Probably easier to source the rotors and pads locally and not pay double for the freight, lines will have to be done locally to match the different hard lines) Is it the same offset as stock? I need some new wheels anyway so it's more info then issue.

[516MA]

i wasnt asking about the set up just the brackets and hubs, i reckon i could do the foot work on the rotors, pads and calipers. But im in favour of the ford falcon or holden commodore calipers i just think it will be much much easier to get the calipers off wreckers and so on.

Thanks Nick

[HoonBoy]

So how much for the hubs and brackets for the Nissan 4-spot setup?. (Probably easier to source the rotors and pads locally and not pay double for the freight, lines will have to be done locally to match the different hard lines) Is it the same offset as stock? I need some new wheels anyway so it's more info then issue.

and....

[SigmaT]

I am working on the MrBishi conversion and just thought I would let you guys know cause I haven't seen it mentioned that you can buy the NSX rotors blank meaning not drilled. I didn't like the look of the rotor after it had been re-drilled in that picture and read somewhere that you can buy rotors blank. I looked at the DBR catalog and rang Autobarn who put in an order for me. I think it was a couple of months before I got them but IMHO its a much better option to get a nice blank rotor drilled with one set of wholes. My car is a work in progress so the rotors, callipers are still sitting on the shelf waiting to go on.

[amgis_obrut]

Yeah i have bought blank from DBA a few times, they always stock blank commo and falc discs but stuff like the Honda and in my case BMW you need to wait till they founder a new batch

[milotan]

Does anyone know whether you can use the hoppers kit with sigma turbo wheels ?I called them but they dont know .

[sig2L]

As long as they are 15" or bigger than all good...

[A112H]

by sig2L » Mon May 10, 2010 10:23 pm

As long as they are 15" or bigger than all good...

Thats not entirely true. Spoke design and facing on the inside of the wheels play a big part.
In this pic the part I have highlighted red is the area you need to measure to ensure your wheel has caliper clearance

[HoonBoy]

A minor update for this thread, trial fitted some R32 skyline 4-spot callipers today. Still using the NSX rotors at the moment. All fits up good but does not fit under the current 15x6 superlites, they do fit under the new 15x8 XXR's that I have so all good for the future.





And no, I don't have any drawings of what was done or brackets for sale

[amgis_obrut]

if your looking for a cheap 5 stud/brake swap copy what I did on my v8 Sigma

with a little extra work and $$$ you can fit Mazda 6 mps 320mm rotors and rx7 4 spots

or

314mm Mitsubishi 3000gt rotors and VT calipers

Im happy with the 290mm falc rotors though i may change to VT calipers

[Rally_2.6LC]

does anyone have a photo of the Hopper Stopper setup on a Sigma (or any car at all for that matter?)
Im seriously thinking about this conversion.
Also will they fit under Sigma Turbo Mags?


Cheers Matt

[oldn64]

I have seen the conversion on a torana but will not help in this application. They do make good stuff and it is truely bolt on but it is upto you whether you wish to pay the moneys.


Cheers

[Rally_2.6LC]

What brand caliper and disc do they use for their conversion?

I was introduced to another possible upgrade, cheaper but little more work. Just finding out if my engineer will pass it.


Cheers Matt

[woops]

It was about 4 years i contacted them bout completing an upgrade but i ended up going to a starion front brake strut instead for the hoppers kit. At the time they were using a ford au3 falcon twin piston caliper and discs. They may have changed to a newer compination but i wouldn't think so.

[oldn64]

We looked into this for the torrana as well and they stated that they were using a ford AU3 caliper but when we ghostimaged the bracketry and then made it and got a set of au3 calipers they were not correct. Suspecting that we got supplied the wrong calipers our supplier ordered a second set, these were the same as what he go tthe first time, so i am dubious about the model of teh caliper that they are using. As for the sigma ones it would seem a very similar design to what is used on teh torana. I would suggest that you purchase from hoppers or look at alternatives, trying to copy or reproduce Hoppers kit will end in tears. Things just arent availible.

Cheers

[amgis_obrut]

I thought it was an AU disc and a VT caliper

AU caliper mounting bolts are about 150mm apart VT is about 80mm

[Rally_2.6LC]

I think im going with Starion for now as I dont have a great deal of money and need the upgrade.
Will continue to look into hoppers in the future though or maybe just a bigger disc with wilwood 4 pot calipers.


Cheers Matt

[oldn64]

I think im going with Starion for now as I dont have a great deal of money and need the upgrade.
Will continue to look into hoppers in the future though or maybe just a bigger disc with wilwood 4 pot calipers.


Cheers Matt

Here is a thought process for you Matt. Now I am thinking purely outside the square and this is what I have investigated for my galant.

Option 1:

Change to "Green" struts, bolt XF discs on and run sigma calipers with modified XF (I think) pads, gives 33% better area on pad and no master upgrade required.

Option 2:

Change to "Non green" struts, bolt commodore rotors on with some machining, use sigma caliper and run modified XF pads

Option 3:

Change to "Non Green" sigma struts, run VT calipers with magna rotors, using standard VT pads, upgrade master to a WB Statesman if using Sigma booster or convert Gemini booster if smaller booster required. Failing that run corvette master unboosted.

Option 4: (direction I am looking at going.)

Change to commdore lower strut. Bolt the Statesman VQ-VS V8 caliper on (is the same as VL Turbo and the SS's) run the Statesman rotor (290mm from memory) cut the spring hanger and tube to suit a camira strut and install the spring plate from a standard mitsu strut so a mitsu spring can be used. Upgrade master to statesman on gemini booster (engineer will not permit me to run unboosted )

All patterns above are either commodore (5 x 120) or Falcon/toyota/mitsu (5 x 114.3) You could get rotors as blanks and pattern to what you want BUT I want stuff I can get off the self and at wreckers not wait for parts to come availible.

Cheers

PS: Just food for thought. I have nto measured up all of these options yet but they would all require a little bit of work. Some might not work well other will be sweet as. The bonus about the commodore one is that they will run with a VT caliper as well if you wish to go bigger again, but you will definately need a bigger master.

[HoonBoy]

Going with Starion brakes is a very short term thought, parts are too hard to get and it's not much of an upgrade given the hassle. Stick with some common calipers so pad selection is easy, the last thing you want is to need pads and have to wait weeks for them in any decent material. VT Commodore and nissan 4 spots are good for this, just about everything available off the shelf. Rotor selection can be similar but unless you are doing big km's you won't wear them out as often so a delay is not as bad. Some common rotors are available undrilled off the shelf (Skyline, VT Commodore, BA Falcon etc. I don't have a full list) the rest you either can't get or have to wait for the next production run to get them before the drill bit does. If you want to stick to common 15inch wheels, the VT caliper is a good choice, it fits under more wheels then the nissan 4-spots as they are smaller. The pedal feel isn't the best, but they do stop an LC very well (combined with a patrol 1 inch master and VN-VP rear calipers on Sigma discs)

If my LC hasn't sold by the end of August, I'l have most of the brake stuff for sale, VT/NSX front, Patrol Master, H190 disc rear end etc. It will need some brackets (but I have the plans for that) and a trade in of a stock LC master, but the rest is there. $1,800 will get you a lot of diff and brakes

[amgis_obrut]

Option 1:

Change to "Green" struts, bolt XF discs on and run sigma calipers with modified XF (I think) pads, gives 33% better area on pad and no master upgrade required.

wont work

disc will hit control arm caliper wont fit over disc


whats the deal with everyone and green struts when it comes to brake conversions?? it makes the job harder using these struts as the caliper mount is more complex, for normal struts just use some 10mm plate and drill 4 correctly spaced holes no need to cut out for the stub


Heres a conversion that will work on normal struts with minimal machining and what I'll be doing very soon

Mitsu 3000GT 314mm discs (needs center bore opened up from 69mm to 83mm)

XA Falcon bearing hub

VT caliper

HQ-WB wheel bearings

Custom caliper mount (home made)

I'll be using this setup with a 1" pbr master from an XF Falcon and a datto sunny booster

[oldn64]

Option 1:

Change to "Green" struts, bolt XF discs on and run sigma calipers with modified XF (I think) pads, gives 33% better area on pad and no master upgrade required.

wont work

disc will hit control arm caliper wont fit over disc


whats the deal with everyone and green struts when it comes to brake conversions?? it makes the job harder using these struts as the caliper mount is more complex, for normal struts just use some 10mm plate and drill 4 correctly spaced holes no need to cut out for the stub

That is one "conversion" I have not played with, it was stated to me and I was a little dubious, I like the commodore route but my biggest issue is teh commdore stud pattern, the rim choice sucks. Whereas the falcon one I can have the rims I want... Still undecided. Might go try getting HQ stud choice which the rims I want come in. But then my back end doesnt work... GRRR too much to work on.

Cheers

[amgis_obrut]

HQ has a 5x20.65 pcd vommodore is 5x120, i guess you going something old school

[oldn64]

Correct I know the difference, old school is nice but the offsets are good in HQ, suit what I am doing. Yes is a nice old school look but new school rim.... hehehe nto giving much away am I.... ;)

Yes HQ is chev which is 4.5"x5 = 120.65mm x 5 commodore is the metric equivalent which holden went to when teh commodore was born and reduced it to 5 x 120. HQ/chev should NEVER be bolted to commodore studs or vise versa. But I have seen tyre places recommend it...EEEEK Commodore is the same as BMW which have a better offset and backspace but the rims dont suit the Galant... :S Really hard to do anything about that though.

Cheers

[A112H]

The 5x114.3 stud pattern of the Ford is much better for wheel options as it is the same as pretty much all Japanese 5 stud except Subaru (5x100). All the imports these days opens up a massive range of cool wheels.

[oldn64]

The 5x114.3 stud pattern of the Ford is much better for wheel options as it is the same as pretty much all Japanese 5 stud except Subaru (5x100). All the imports these days opens up a massive range of cool wheels.

Yes true but the set of these I have sitting in the shed are in Chev pattern....



Or a set of long beach customs 17" versions of the HG GTS monaro rims look porn under the Coupe (yes I have tried a set under the guads...yumm is all I will say) basically period rim just better choice of rubber.... I like chrome what can I say!!! If you want a look have a look here.....

http://www.slide.com/r/d55kqs6c4D-Npwur82uhCkrWvVPWxa5P

Cheers