Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

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Shifta
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Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Hey guys,

Next goal I have with the siggy is to see if I can get the factory aircon working but something isn't quite right. I can't see how I can tension the compression belt with what I have - something is missing. Here is a pic.

Image

Any chance someone can show me a picture of what it should look like and maybe steer me in the right direction? I was going to hit up UPI today to check out some non-Turbo setups but ran out of time.

Cheers,

Craig
camB
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by camB »

I've taken mine off... but it had an adjuster underneath which tensioned both the alternator and compressor.
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Skidmark
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Skidmark »

Ill get some pics tommorow arve, after work when the sun shines.
85 GN ,daily driver
86 GN ,resto project .
C_Fernance
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by C_Fernance »

Skidmark wrote:Ill get some pics tommorow arve, after work when the sun shines.
You already have got a pic. I just stole this one from your project thread.

Image
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Skidmark
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Skidmark »

Cool ! (HaHa, cool---air con, no pun intended) do you want any from other angles or is that OK ?
85 GN ,daily driver
86 GN ,resto project .
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Thanks guys. mmm, I'm not sure what's going on! Do I assume that if the top Balance shaft is still in the motor that there is an extra pulley for the air con belt? I think I've somehow mounted the condensor too high and that pulley is missing on mine........
camB
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by camB »

Mine didn't have the extra pulley. Belt went straight from compressor to crank pulley. I'll have to wander out to where I've stashed the parts for a photo though. Definitely was tensioned on the same sliding piece that the alternator tensioner bolt goes through. (Was a turd to adjust from memory)
GB_BB4C
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by GB_BB4C »

Straight from the GH workshop manual, hope this help's.
Image
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Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Had another look at the thread when I got home and then went out to the shed to take another look. Still stumped. The compressor sits too high so it can't use the same bracket as the Alternator. The compressor actually pivots up and away from the motor and alternator so somehow it needs to be held "up". I think a trip to the wreckers is needed although I hope the non Turbo models have the same setup......
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81GL
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by 81GL »

Thought it might be worth a mention...

The air-con from my GH is like skidmark's, & I know it is not a genuine complete set up, was an after market kit that was put in the vehicle (albeit it was done at the dealer)
-Universal condenser etc.

Just something to keep in mind at the wreckers.

Nick.
Old school Mitsu's, its not a hobby; it's a life style.
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Thanks mate, I'll keep that in mind. The last time I went to UPI there was only one GH there so I'm hoping I have more luck tomorrow!
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Ok, so after two trips to the wreckers today and way too much time spent on it, I sorted this out. First trip to the wreckers I found that none of the GH sigmas came close, but the GE's with aircon had the same setup. Interesting as my GE workshop manual doesn't appear to have any reference to aircon. So initially I went with bugger all tools as I just wanted to see what I was missing. There appeared to be an extra bracket for the condensor but it was hard to tell. I managed to find an alternator bracket so I figured that might work. So I hooked it home and tried all variations of combinations - not happening. So I legged it back to the wreckers with all the right tools and proceeded to pull the whole compressor mount of including the alternator and compressor adjustment brackets - I wanted to avoid another trip back. When I got home I found the small bracket was all I needed. The standard setup for a Siggy Turbo is this:

The same timing cover bolt secures two adjustment brackets:
1. the Alternator bracket that is slightly offset at the end that bolts to the motor
2. A smaller adjusting bracket specifically for adujsting the Aircon compressor.

The two brackets together kinda look like a pair scissors. The interesting thing is that the adjustment for the alternator is the at the right end of the bracket whereas the compressor bracket is the opposite - the adjustment is on the left side.

So the result is that it's all connected and the motor turns the compressor. As expected, the aircon still doesn't work ( who knows how long it's been disconnected ). I'm happy now though as I can now get the gas etc looked at to see if I can get it going :).
camB
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by camB »

Yep, that's what mine had. So very sorry not to still have it connected or photos which would have made life easier for you. :\
On some GH Sigmas there was another bracket up the top left of the engine, like in the workshop manual (and I'm kicking myself that I didn't know what it was for and sent it to God with my parts car shell), but the way you've set it up was how mine was working.
Am I right in remembering it's a prick to adjust?
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

It all worked out in the end :). The adjustment would be a pain - luckily a mate came round and he lifted the compressor up while I was able to lie on the ground and tighten the bolts from underneath - I woulda struggled on my own!
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Skidmark
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Skidmark »

Well done dude,nice cool cruising coming your way :thumpsup:
85 GN ,daily driver
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camB
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by camB »

I'll add a note to this thread...
What about the gas? No-one has the R31 (?) that was originally in them (CFC issues) so where do you get it gassed? If you change gas, do you have to get new pipes or anything? I'm thinking of reinstalling mine if it's a simple regas.
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Yeah not sure on that. I'll hopefully get it checked out over the next few weeks by an aircon specialist so will update the thread with the results :).
john116
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by john116 »

The original refrigerant gas used was R12, this is still available, but is expensive and in short supply. Also, it can only be supplied/recovered by an EPA approved person. The 'newer' type gas was R134, which was made mandatory in 1994 for all new vehicles.

You can't charge an R12 system with the new type, without modifications. You'll need to replace all flare fittings with rubber o-ring type fittings (includes compressor, condensor, receiver/dryer and evaporator). You'll potentially need a new condensor, as the new gas isn't as good as R-12 in terms of heat release. Additionally, the old type oil used in the compressors as a lubricant, is not compatible with the new refrigerant, so you'll need to flush the system out completely to remove the old oil.

There is, an environmentally friendly alternative though. And no, I don't work for them, but there is a product called Hychill, which can be used in old car aircon systems with no retrofitting (new o-ring fittings, etc) required. www.hychill.com.au

You will still need a vacuum pump to remove all the air/moisture out of the system though, before re-charging. If you do it yourself, you'll also need some pressure gauges etc to check that you've added the correct amount of gas, and the system is functioning as it should.

I'd highly recommend replacing the receiver/drier (do this every 5 years), and also the TX valve (located on the evaporator unit inside the car).

I replaced those parts, flushed the system in my GE Sigma, and despite the compressor being 30 years old, it works great, and blows cold air out the centre vents at around 10 degrees celcius.

For aircon info from the GE Sigma service manual, download here: http://www.btscompany.com/Sigma_GE_Service_Manual

Download section 24.


John
Shifta
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by Shifta »

Thanks John, some very useful info there. Dam, looks like a way bigger job than I thought! The project may take a back seat for a while after reading all that!
camB
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by camB »

I'm going to check out the availability of the replacement gas in Melbourne... I'll keep you posted.
Out of interest John, did you get it gassed with the hychill stuff? How much was the regas (if you don't mind)?
john116
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by john116 »

Hi - yes, gassed mine with the Hychill stuff. Did it myself. Had to buy the vacuum pump, a set of gauges, and the gas of course.

J
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Re: Sigma Turbo Air con - what am I missing?

Post by AlexSell »

Not entirely sure if I'm posting in the correct thread but everyone here seems to know what they are talking about.

I have just recently bought a incredibly well maintained 1983 Sigma GL Stationwagon. The gentleman whom I purchased it from is the original owner. The wagon has just clicked over 200k kms. Unfortunately it was bought brand new without Power Steering or Air Con. I have browsed dozens of forums and from what I can gather it is possible to hunt down an Air Con system and install it myself. I simply need to know everything that everyone can tell me. This is my first car and with my girlfriend expecting our first child this July I've had to realize that the motorcycles aren't going to cut it.

Feel free to ask for any information you require and I will be happy to provide. I'm more than willing to provide pictures if they are needed.

Thanks in advance for any and all help.
AlexSell
1983 Sigma GL Wagon - Blue
1984 Honda VF700 - Maroon
2006 Kawasaki GPX250R - Black/Green
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